Hello, last Sunday I played with Ashi and Hellboy, I didn't take the pictures but overall the game a Ork vs Necron battle between newbies was a good one tha I could have won (If the last defkotpa had survived for another turn) and barely managed to scrap a draw (after the monolith managed to recall one necron warriors unit that had just stopped fleeing.) well overall a good game but one that brough up some questions that I want to share with you so you might clear what we should do.
First one: Ashi, got a doubt about the movement in the assault ´phase, he says that since in the rulebook says that most units move 6 inches when assaulting, then the defkotpas I have in my ork army should move only move that distance, but I'm of the opinion that a unit moves in the assault phase the same distance that It moves in the movement phase so they are allowed to assault up to 12 inches, who of us are correct.
Another question that a raised was the movement in hills, since I come from old rules (when I played WHFB) I usually play with them as normal terrain while Ashi says that is dangerous terrain.
Last question is a minor one, and is about the monolith relocating warriors that have just regrouped are they allowed to behave normally (move, shoot and/or assault)?
those are the questions that we didn't solve in our own so we want to hear from your knowkedge.
Thanks
The tales of a lone, well not so lone anymore, Games Workshop collector.
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ReplyDeleteOk trying again. My post regarding the bikes assault was all messed up so I deleted it and forgot to copy it somewhere. At least the first part is still intact so I'm going to post that. And redo the bikes assault part and hills too.
ReplyDeleteOk I have been doing my research and found some interesting things. Mostly from the Necron FAQ and my neglecting of the ordnance rule.
Regarding the unit of warriors that regrouped at the beginning of the turn and was teleported through the portal. On the rule book it says that they may shoot move 3" and assault as normal, but for they count as moving on that player's turn. And on the FAQ it says the following:
Q. Can a Necron unit that teleports through a Monolith’s portal move after emerging?
A. Only if the Monolith (and the teleporting unit) hasn’t already moved that Movement phase. If the unit has already moved before being teleported, it may only be deployed within 2" of the portal; if it hasn’t already moved, it may deploy out 2" and then move normally.
So yes they can be teleported through the portal, only their movement is hindered.
For the arc guns and the particle cannon, you cannot fire both in the same turn as the particle cannon is a ordnance weapon and those don't allow any other weapon to be fired from that vehicle.
Q. Can the Monolith fire its particle whip and gauss flux projectors in the same turn?
A. No, the Monolith cannot fire the particle whip (as it is an ordnance weapon) and gauss flux projectors in the same turn. The particle whip uses the large blast marker and its range and line of sight are measured from any of the Monolith’s weapons.
So, I cheated there :P
Regarding to DeffKoptas assaulting 12". Bike section fails to specify what distance we must use. Kinda lame since they do specify for jump infantry (6) and cavalry (12). Ok now Jet bikes section says they act the same as bikes in the assault phase as they move close to the ground. Nothing answering our question though. Interesting tid bit in the elder jetbikes section though, says they are allowed to move 6" in the assault phase even if they do not assault. Ok so first hint that assault distance for jetbikes (and bikes) is 6".
ReplyDeleteOK, but if we disregard that last part because it does specify it's for Eldar jetbikes we must find a definitive answer. At the start of the Unit Types section it says the following:
"Except for the rules detailed in this section for each unit type, these units follow the same rules as infantry"
And again at the insert in the next page:
"If the Codex doesn't say any different, follow the rules for the appropriate unit type, and if those rules don't say anything different, follow the basic rules for infantry"
Ok so lets see what basic rules for infantry say for the assault phase regarding to movement:
"All of the models in an assaulting unit make their assault move following the same rules as in THE Movement phase.."
Notice it doesn't say "the same rules as in THEIR movement phase" but "the Movement phase." So, let's look at what the rules for the Movement phase regarding to distance for basic infantry are:
"Infantry move up to six inches in the Movement phase"
Since we are supposed to use the rules for basic infantry then there they are! So after a lot of searching around we find that indeed the assault distance of bikes and jetbikes is 6".
And lastly regarding to the hill. We kinda screwed up there since we specified what kind of terrain the rest of the things in the table were but skipped the hills. And in the rulebook they say slight hills are clear terrain but then show a flat area terrain with two trees and say it's difficult terrain! Thing is I didn't say it was dangerous terrain but difficult.
I'm happy we are clearing this rules though, as we are still learning and reading the rule book again and again isn't as fun as encountering this little things and learning about them as we go. Sucks that I won't be playing or painting till december since I won't learn or play or pain anymore :(
Oh well, Raidengard will take my place for our bi-monthly games.
Hope I helped clear things up.
thanks Ashi, is good to clear thing as we are doing it because it allows us to learn a good thing, about the Monolith is great, to know that I wont be suffering that punishment again for it was indeed painful.
ReplyDeleteand about the about the eldar jetbikes and jump infantry as a matter of fact. what you read there is an additional movement that they can use so the can either move 12 in the movement phase and 12 in the assault during the assault phase (repeating a bit but is for clarity's sake) OR they can move 12 in the movement phase and have another free move that is 6 inches long during the assault phase providing they didn't assault that turn. and remember that cavalry are a sub type of bike so if they move 12 in the assault then why not their peers?
and about the hills I'm glad to read about that, because it is consistent with Fantasy where hills, and let's be clear hills that don't have step sides but more gentle ones as Hellboy did, are normal terrain, about your confusion is that the flat terrain you see is not clearly stated but is intended to represent a swamp or something dangerous.
Just one question about the bi-monthly observation it means you are temporaly not playing becuase of workload?
ReplyDeleteUnless a Codex says otherwise, all Bikes can assault 6". Pg 53 the box refers jetbikes as bikes, above it.
ReplyDeleteUnless a Codex says otherwise, all ordnance fires exclusive of all other weapons (one exception is in the IG Codex with the Lehman Russ which basically treats ordnance on LRT as being able to fire as a normal weapon). Pg 58.
As for transports (the Monolith), unless the Codex says otherwise, anytime the transport vehicle moves, it counts as the unit(s) inside it as moving, which means they can disembark and shoot, but not assault. Also, if they have heavy weapons, they can't shoot them and rapid fire is limited to 12". Pg 67.
Before starting the game, but after placing all terrain pieces, discuss with your opponent(s) what each piece of terrain is, i.e. difficult, dangerous, impassable, for what type of model, i.e. tank traps are clear for infantry but dangerous for vehicles, and what cover each gives. All, decided if you have any area terrain, i.e. this piece of cardboard with 2 trees represents a small forest of trees. Pg 13-14.
I'd like to play with you guys if next time if my schedule allows it. It would be myself (IG), my middle son (Tau) and my yougest son (Ork).
Ashi, where are you going uintil Decemnber?
I'm going to continue my studies in FL. and all my paints and minis are staying here.
ReplyDeleteWhat I want to organize once I get back is a tournament, 500 pt armies since that includes every army we have. I have to think of the rules. Well, I will have lots of time to think about them :D
500 points is barely an HQ & 2 Troops. LOL
ReplyDeleteYou can visit some hobby shops there in FL and pick up a few "additions", plus any paint that you need.
FYI.
Also, there might be an official "Games Workshop" near where you are going, but no guarantees.
When do you leave?
yeah, I browsed google maps and found some shops that aren't too far away. Won't have much time to paint but new additions are a must ! :D
ReplyDeleteyeah 500 points is very few models. I made some lists for eldar chaos sm necron and tau, they have walkers and transports. It might be fun.
I leave this saturday.
Looking forward to meeting you when you get back.
ReplyDeleteWhat are you studying and where in FL?
Is sad for the no games part but is always great to study and is just for a time. I expect that we play soon december might come sooner than we think, good think is that you might be abble to bring some sabol army transports they are great and we now need them so our miniatures dont get harmed during transport.
ReplyDeleteSo who all is leaving?
ReplyDeleteOnly me, gonna finish my bachelors in computer science at FIU.
ReplyDeleteWell, one might think that there will be no games till i come back but my brother will bring all my stuff to wendy's so, there will still be warhammer sundays.
Today we assembled a couple of eldar stuff. I might have it ready before I leave.
Did I say that my degree is in Comp Sci Info Systems.
ReplyDelete